Crowdsourcing fhbsha2017: Difference between revisions

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[[File:Fleur_de_sureau_casserole_faa09052017.jpg|thumb|Elderflower/Fleur de sureau]]
[[File:Fleur_de_sureau_casserole_faa09052017.jpg|thumb|Elderflower/Fleur de sureau]]
[[File:Kefir_cake_faa26052017.jpg|thumb|Kefir cake!]]
[[File:Kefir_cake_faa26052017.jpg|thumb|Kefir cake!]]
===Campaign status===
* Total amount desired: '''eur 2500.00'''
* Number of donations: '''27'''
* Total amount received/pledged: '''eur 1730.00'''
* Updated 20-7-2017


As most of you are well aware '''[https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Village:Foodhackingbase Food Hacking Base (fhb) at SHA2017]''' happens only if people dedicate their, time energy and monetary resources to the project. This year we are for the first time running an '''Independent Crowdsourcing Campaign''' therefore not using any traditional crowdsourcing platform (1). All the important info about this project and how to support it is on this page, additional resources are listed as well. Please read it well, we hope you will find it interesting, you will help us to make it better, spread the word and of course if you can support it by monetary funds!
As most of you are well aware '''[https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Village:Foodhackingbase Food Hacking Base (fhb) at SHA2017]''' happens only if people dedicate their, time energy and monetary resources to the project. This year we are for the first time running an '''Independent Crowdsourcing Campaign''' therefore not using any traditional crowdsourcing platform (1). All the important info about this project and how to support it is on this page, additional resources are listed as well. Please read it well, we hope you will find it interesting, you will help us to make it better, spread the word and of course if you can support it by monetary funds!
Update: since we passed the 700 euro mark, we ordered a new tent!


===Overview===
===Overview===


Food Hacking Base (fhb) is a project focused on food, drink and bio activities which boundaries we will again try to push forward, this time at [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Main_Page SHA2017]. The project is run by people who are into these activities, welcoming new people who would like to join us and participate. As a group we will set up a well organized experimental kitchen, workshop venues, presentation desk and other needed facilities creating food, drink and bio hub sharing the knowledge and experience. It is an open platform focusing on experimental and educational so you can join variety of interesting activities ranging from entry friendly '''tasting events''' like "Cheese Rendezvous" or "Whisky Tasting", bit more educational and practical '''workshops''' like "Kombucha is Easy" or "Soft Cheese Making" to '''really specific projects''' like "Experimental Incubator Build Up" etc. The schedule will be packed with events, therefore many reasons for you to visit us. For all of this and more we need people who make it happen, who tell others what is it about, spreading the word and of course we need people to contribute also financially. Some of us have more time but less money and some the other way around, it is up to you to consider your particular situation and support this project as you decide is best for you.
Food Hacking Base (fhb) is a project focused on food, drink and bio activities which boundaries we will again try to push forward, this time at [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Main_Page SHA2017]. The project is run by enthusiast who love to play with whats mentioned above, welcoming new people who wants to come and run the show together trying to be excellent to each other. As a group we will set up a well organized experimental kitchen, workshop venues, presentation desk and other needed facilities creating food, drink and bio hub sharing the knowledge and experience. It is an open platform focusing on experimental and educational so you can join variety of interesting activities ranging from entry friendly '''tasting events''' like our famous [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Cheese_Rendezvous "Cheese Rendezvous"] or "Whisky Tasting", bit more educational and practical '''workshops''' like [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Kombucha_is_Easy "Kombucha is Easy"] or "Soft Cheese Making" to really '''specific projects''' like [https://foodhackingbase.org/wiki/Experimental_Incubator "Experimental Incubator Build Up"], [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Projects:Probiotic_Drinks_Everywhere Probiotic Drinks Everywhere] et cetera. The schedule will be packed with events, therefore many reasons for you to visit us. For all of this and more we need people who make it happen, who tell others what is it about, spreading the word and of course we need you to contribute also financially. Some of us have more time but less money and for some it is the other way around. It is up to you to consider your particular situation and your preferred form of supporting this project, we appreciate it all!
 
'''We do appreciate any form of your contribution!'''   
 
===Campaign status===
* Total amount desired: eur 2500.00
* Number of donations: 2
* Total amount received/pledged: eur 200.00


===Donating===
===Donating===
You can donate in the following ways:
You can donate in the following ways:
* paypal to https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar - How about [https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar/100 100] or [https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar/25 25] euro?
* '''PayPal''' to https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar - How about [https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar/100 100], [https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar/50 50] or [https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar/10 10] euro?
* bank transfer to IBAN NL06ABNA0435865005 M.J. van der Peijl (in IJmuiden, The Netherlands, BIC ABNANL2A) with description 'fhbsha2017'
* '''Bank transfer''' to IBAN NL06ABNA0435865005 M.J. van der Peijl (in IJmuiden, The Netherlands, BIC ABNANL2A) with description "fhbsha2017" plus "perk name" if you claim one
* bitcoin donation to wallet [https://blockchain.info/address/1DeMWncWd84QpppbZbcuFxLuoihfWbPW1M 1DeMWncWd84QpppbZbcuFxLuoihfWbPW1M]
* '''Bitcoin''' donation to wallet [https://blockchain.info/address/1DeMWncWd84QpppbZbcuFxLuoihfWbPW1M 1DeMWncWd84QpppbZbcuFxLuoihfWbPW1M]
* pledge to pay the amount at SHA2017 in cash (send us email for this pledge!)
* pledge to pay the amount at SHA2017 in cash (send us email for this pledge!)
* most of the details above have been used by our group during last years and it worked very well for us!


===Perks===
===Perks===


=====Access to all (€100)=====
==== * Access to all (€100)====
You will be (one of) the guest of honor at any fhb activity at SHA2017 - 3 meals a day, coffee, and every workshop is waiting for you!
 
* Price €100
Price: '''€100'''
* Available: 20
Available: '''15'''
* Claimed: 2
Claimed: '''9'''
=====Absynth-make-our-own (€10)=====
 
Bag of dried absynth leaves to make your own, enough for one liter of cold-macerated vodka absynth, recipe and other spices included this is not the stuff you get on ebay! Both ''Artemisia absinthium'' and ''Artemisia maritima'' (the last one is NEVER available, but really nice) are included, add some stamps for shipping or come and collect (and taste).
You will be (one of) the guest of honor at any fhb activity at SHA2017 - 3 meals a day, coffee, and every workshop is waiting for you! Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
* Price €10
 
* Available: 10
==== * Hungry hacker (€50)====
* Claimed: 0
 
=====Probiotic Power Drinks (€10) =====
Price: '''€50'''
Five 500 ml well labeled bottles (plastic) of hacker-brewed fermented probiotic softdrinks like non alcoholic ginger beer, mate soda, made especially for you to keep you nice and fit enjoying the SHA2017 fully! Vegan options are on the list of course, with the queen ''Kombucha cosmopolita'' included. PS Bottles are plastic, well labeled to avoid any mishaps.
Available: '''15'''
* Price €10
Claimed: '''12'''
* Available: 20
 
* Claimed: 0
If €100 for everything is too much for you, well go for €50 than. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
=====Coffee Addict (€15)=====
 
Come and get your daily caffeine shots! Taste our coffees during the event whenever you feel like we will try to provide variety of utilities to make them so you can pick up your favorite.
==== * FHB Promo Collection====
* Price €15
 
* Available: 20
Price: '''€5'''
* Claimed: 0
Available: '''50'''
Claimed: '''1'''
 
We are going to make some fhb promotion "materials" as usually. By selecting this perk you will reward yourself with nice stickers and maybe other small things, help us to fund it in advance and of course you will support our presence at SHA2017 in general. We would be happy if you could pick it up in person or through a friend, but if asked we can send it too. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * Absynth-make-our-own (€10)====
 
Price: '''€10'''
Available: '''10'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
Bag of dried absynth leaves to make your own, enough for one liter of cold-macerated vodka absynth, recipe and other spices included this is not the stuff you get on ebay! Both ''Artemisia absinthium'' and ''Artemisia maritima'' (the last one is NEVER available, but really nice) are included, add some stamps for shipping or come and collect (and taste). Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Projects:Probiotic_Drinks_Everywhere Probiotic Drinks Everywhere] (€10)====
 
Price: '''€10'''
Available: '''20'''
Claimed: '''1'''
 
Five 500 ml well labeled bottles (plastic) of hacker-brewed fermented probiotic soft drinks like non alcoholic ginger beer, mate soda, made especially for you to keep you nice and fit enjoying the SHA2017 fully! Vegan options are on the list of course, with the queen ''Kombucha cosmopolita'' included. This perk is part of the [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Projects:Probiotic_Drinks_Everywhere Probiotic Drinks Everywhere project]. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * Coffee Addict (€15)====
 
Price: '''€15'''
Available: '''20'''
Claimed: '''1'''
 
Come and get your daily caffeine shots! Taste our coffees during the event whenever you feel like we will try to provide variety of utilities to make them so you can pick up your favorite and of course main ingredient of high quality. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Cider_Flows Cider Flows (€20)]====
 
Price '''€20'''
Available: '''7'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
You will be welcome to the cider tasting where variety of cider of commercial, small local production and also home made creations will be tasted. If you are into the ciders this is a must and please do bring your one or some interesting samples! [https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/cidersha2017/ Please sign in here for the self organized session] so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Cheese_Rendezvous FHB Cheese Rendezvous pass] (€20)====
 
Price: '''€20'''
Available: '''20'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
Food Hacking Base Cheese Rendezvous is one of our top tasting events. We go through 20-30 samples of high quality cheeses and condiments with people who know. There is big interest in this event, this is your chance to get your spot, plus helping us to fund this event. If you are into cheeses and you are coming to SHA2017 don't miss this one and do not forget to bring some interesting samples! The truffle cheese is the unofficial winer of 33c3 tastings! Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution. [https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/cheesetasting/ Please sign in here for the self organized session] so we can keep track more easily
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Introduction_to_soybean_fermentation Tempeh Making, Introduction to soy bean fermentation (€20)]====
 
If you are interested in Asian fermentations of soy beans and other legumes turning them into ferments like [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miso miso], [https://ko.wikipedia.org/wiki/%EC%B2%AD%EA%B5%AD%EC%9E%A5 청국장], [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natt%C5%8D nattō] or [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempeh tempeh] and other, this is a good opening session for you. If you book now by getting this perk you are in and I ([[User:Algoldor|Algoldor]]) have a better chance to get a bit of cash for my projects which are of course including fermentations described above and more! [https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/tempehmakingsha2017/ Please sign in here for the self organized session] so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
Price '''€20'''
Available: '''7'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Kombucha_is_Easy Kombucha is Easy!] ====
 
Do you love [[kombucha|kombucha]]? Really interested in learning more about it? Than come and make it with us bringing home some beverage and also culture so you can continue to do your own. If you book now by getting this perk you are in and I ([[User:Algoldor|Algoldor]]) have a better chance to get a bit of cash for my projects which are of course including kombucha making! [https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/kombuchasha2017/ Please sign in here for the self organized session] so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
Price '''€20'''
Available: '''7'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Fermenting_with_Kefir Fermenting with kefir] ====
 
If you are into the kefir or yogurts then you should come and learn how to do your own getting some extra tips especially on what else you can use the kefir ferment for - like probiotic beverage making, cheesecakes etc. If you book now by getting this perk you are in and I ([[User:Algoldor|Algoldor]]) have a better chance to get a bit of cash for my projects which are of course including kefir related activities! [https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/kefirsha2017/ Please sign in here for the self organized session] so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * Experimental Incubator 2017 (€25)====
 
Price: '''€25'''
Available: '''5'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
You will receive Experimental Incubator kit, which includes the "arduino brain", sensoric system and more. This kit is designed to make fermentation more easy, check fhb wiki for more details under the project section. It looks like it may come with new 3D printed casing. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Projects:Probiotic_Drinks_Everywhere Probiotic Drinks Everywhere] - crate (€30)====
 
Price: '''€30'''
Available: '''5'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
Crate or twenty 500 ml well labeled bottles (plastic) of hacker-brewed fermented probiotic soft drinks like non alcoholic ginger beer, mate soda, made especially for you to keep you nice and fit enjoying the SHA2017 fully! Vegan options are on the list of course, with the queen ''Kombucha cosmopolita'' included. This perk is part of the [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Projects:Probiotic_Drinks_Everywhere Probiotic Drinks Everywhere project]. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
==== * [https://wiki.sha2017.org/w/Session:Advanced_Probiotic_Brewing Advanced Probiotic Brewing] (€10) ====
 
This event is especially for people who are doing fermentation for some time and would like to talk and organize projects in this field promoting the fermentation movement. Money which we get will be used to support fermentation related activities, we will decide what and how based on our discussion. [https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/brewingsha2017/ Please sign in here for the self organized session] so we can keep the track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.
 
Price: '''€10'''
Available: '''10'''
Claimed: '''0'''
 
=== FHB SHA2017 Diary===
 
[[fhbsha2017diary|sfhbsha2017 diary]]


'''Notes'''
'''Notes'''


* 1. We have decided not to use Indiegogo or other crowdsourcing platforms because we think that the provided conditions are seriously worsening. We were not happy with close to 10% of the funds being deduced from the contributed money (platform fee plus PayPal) and recently the fact that the funds are not available during campaigning even for the "flexible funding" and one has to wait another week or two after to use them was kind of the last drop. Another very important point is that during the last four years or so since we use these platforms we did not get nearly any contributions from people who we would not know. 99% percent of our supporters are aware of our project from past years and they support long term. We are not saying the the crowdsourcing platforms are bad but we just do not see really a reason or special profit why to use them for our projects at the moment.
* 1. We have decided not to use Indiegogo or other crowdsourcing platforms because we think that the provided conditions are seriously worsening. We were not happy with close to 10% of the funds being deduced from the contributed money (platform fee plus PayPal) and recently the fact that the funds are not available during campaigning even for the "flexible funding" and one has to wait another week or two after to use them was kind of the last drop. Another very important point is that during the last four years or so since we use these platforms we did not get nearly any contributions from people who we would not know. 99% percent of our supporters are aware of our project from past years and they support long term. We are not saying the the crowdsourcing platforms are bad but we just do not see really a reason or special profit why to use them for our projects at the moment.

Latest revision as of 20:32, 30 July 2017

Water kefir beverages, courtesy of Daniel Kolbus
Nattō
Crab for seafood chowder.
Tempeh, courtesy of Dan Merc
Elderflower/Fleur de sureau
Kefir cake!

Campaign status

  • Total amount desired: eur 2500.00
  • Number of donations: 27
  • Total amount received/pledged: eur 1730.00
  • Updated 20-7-2017

As most of you are well aware Food Hacking Base (fhb) at SHA2017 happens only if people dedicate their, time energy and monetary resources to the project. This year we are for the first time running an Independent Crowdsourcing Campaign therefore not using any traditional crowdsourcing platform (1). All the important info about this project and how to support it is on this page, additional resources are listed as well. Please read it well, we hope you will find it interesting, you will help us to make it better, spread the word and of course if you can support it by monetary funds!

Update: since we passed the 700 euro mark, we ordered a new tent!

Overview

Food Hacking Base (fhb) is a project focused on food, drink and bio activities which boundaries we will again try to push forward, this time at SHA2017. The project is run by enthusiast who love to play with whats mentioned above, welcoming new people who wants to come and run the show together trying to be excellent to each other. As a group we will set up a well organized experimental kitchen, workshop venues, presentation desk and other needed facilities creating food, drink and bio hub sharing the knowledge and experience. It is an open platform focusing on experimental and educational so you can join variety of interesting activities ranging from entry friendly tasting events like our famous "Cheese Rendezvous" or "Whisky Tasting", bit more educational and practical workshops like "Kombucha is Easy" or "Soft Cheese Making" to really specific projects like "Experimental Incubator Build Up", Probiotic Drinks Everywhere et cetera. The schedule will be packed with events, therefore many reasons for you to visit us. For all of this and more we need people who make it happen, who tell others what is it about, spreading the word and of course we need you to contribute also financially. Some of us have more time but less money and for some it is the other way around. It is up to you to consider your particular situation and your preferred form of supporting this project, we appreciate it all!

Donating

You can donate in the following ways:

  • PayPal to https://paypal.me/bigmacfoobar - How about 100, 50 or 10 euro?
  • Bank transfer to IBAN NL06ABNA0435865005 M.J. van der Peijl (in IJmuiden, The Netherlands, BIC ABNANL2A) with description "fhbsha2017" plus "perk name" if you claim one
  • Bitcoin donation to wallet 1DeMWncWd84QpppbZbcuFxLuoihfWbPW1M
  • pledge to pay the amount at SHA2017 in cash (send us email for this pledge!)
  • most of the details above have been used by our group during last years and it worked very well for us!

Perks

* Access to all (€100)

Price: €100 Available: 15 Claimed: 9

You will be (one of) the guest of honor at any fhb activity at SHA2017 - 3 meals a day, coffee, and every workshop is waiting for you! Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Hungry hacker (€50)

Price: €50 Available: 15 Claimed: 12

If €100 for everything is too much for you, well go for €50 than. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* FHB Promo Collection

Price: €5 Available: 50 Claimed: 1

We are going to make some fhb promotion "materials" as usually. By selecting this perk you will reward yourself with nice stickers and maybe other small things, help us to fund it in advance and of course you will support our presence at SHA2017 in general. We would be happy if you could pick it up in person or through a friend, but if asked we can send it too. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Absynth-make-our-own (€10)

Price: €10 Available: 10 Claimed: 0

Bag of dried absynth leaves to make your own, enough for one liter of cold-macerated vodka absynth, recipe and other spices included this is not the stuff you get on ebay! Both Artemisia absinthium and Artemisia maritima (the last one is NEVER available, but really nice) are included, add some stamps for shipping or come and collect (and taste). Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Probiotic Drinks Everywhere (€10)

Price: €10 Available: 20 Claimed: 1

Five 500 ml well labeled bottles (plastic) of hacker-brewed fermented probiotic soft drinks like non alcoholic ginger beer, mate soda, made especially for you to keep you nice and fit enjoying the SHA2017 fully! Vegan options are on the list of course, with the queen Kombucha cosmopolita included. This perk is part of the Probiotic Drinks Everywhere project. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Coffee Addict (€15)

Price: €15 Available: 20 Claimed: 1

Come and get your daily caffeine shots! Taste our coffees during the event whenever you feel like we will try to provide variety of utilities to make them so you can pick up your favorite and of course main ingredient of high quality. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Cider Flows (€20)

Price €20 Available: 7 Claimed: 0

You will be welcome to the cider tasting where variety of cider of commercial, small local production and also home made creations will be tasted. If you are into the ciders this is a must and please do bring your one or some interesting samples! Please sign in here for the self organized session so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* FHB Cheese Rendezvous pass (€20)

Price: €20 Available: 20 Claimed: 0

Food Hacking Base Cheese Rendezvous is one of our top tasting events. We go through 20-30 samples of high quality cheeses and condiments with people who know. There is big interest in this event, this is your chance to get your spot, plus helping us to fund this event. If you are into cheeses and you are coming to SHA2017 don't miss this one and do not forget to bring some interesting samples! The truffle cheese is the unofficial winer of 33c3 tastings! Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution. Please sign in here for the self organized session so we can keep track more easily

* Tempeh Making, Introduction to soy bean fermentation (€20)

If you are interested in Asian fermentations of soy beans and other legumes turning them into ferments like miso, 청국장, nattō or tempeh and other, this is a good opening session for you. If you book now by getting this perk you are in and I (Algoldor) have a better chance to get a bit of cash for my projects which are of course including fermentations described above and more! Please sign in here for the self organized session so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

Price €20 Available: 7 Claimed: 0

* Kombucha is Easy!

Do you love kombucha? Really interested in learning more about it? Than come and make it with us bringing home some beverage and also culture so you can continue to do your own. If you book now by getting this perk you are in and I (Algoldor) have a better chance to get a bit of cash for my projects which are of course including kombucha making! Please sign in here for the self organized session so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

Price €20 Available: 7 Claimed: 0

* Fermenting with kefir

If you are into the kefir or yogurts then you should come and learn how to do your own getting some extra tips especially on what else you can use the kefir ferment for - like probiotic beverage making, cheesecakes etc. If you book now by getting this perk you are in and I (Algoldor) have a better chance to get a bit of cash for my projects which are of course including kefir related activities! Please sign in here for the self organized session so we can keep track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Experimental Incubator 2017 (€25)

Price: €25 Available: 5 Claimed: 0

You will receive Experimental Incubator kit, which includes the "arduino brain", sensoric system and more. This kit is designed to make fermentation more easy, check fhb wiki for more details under the project section. It looks like it may come with new 3D printed casing. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Probiotic Drinks Everywhere - crate (€30)

Price: €30 Available: 5 Claimed: 0

Crate or twenty 500 ml well labeled bottles (plastic) of hacker-brewed fermented probiotic soft drinks like non alcoholic ginger beer, mate soda, made especially for you to keep you nice and fit enjoying the SHA2017 fully! Vegan options are on the list of course, with the queen Kombucha cosmopolita included. This perk is part of the Probiotic Drinks Everywhere project. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

* Advanced Probiotic Brewing (€10)

This event is especially for people who are doing fermentation for some time and would like to talk and organize projects in this field promoting the fermentation movement. Money which we get will be used to support fermentation related activities, we will decide what and how based on our discussion. Please sign in here for the self organized session so we can keep the track more easily. Do not forget write the perk name when making the contribution.

Price: €10 Available: 10 Claimed: 0

FHB SHA2017 Diary

sfhbsha2017 diary

Notes

  • 1. We have decided not to use Indiegogo or other crowdsourcing platforms because we think that the provided conditions are seriously worsening. We were not happy with close to 10% of the funds being deduced from the contributed money (platform fee plus PayPal) and recently the fact that the funds are not available during campaigning even for the "flexible funding" and one has to wait another week or two after to use them was kind of the last drop. Another very important point is that during the last four years or so since we use these platforms we did not get nearly any contributions from people who we would not know. 99% percent of our supporters are aware of our project from past years and they support long term. We are not saying the the crowdsourcing platforms are bad but we just do not see really a reason or special profit why to use them for our projects at the moment.